[Menvi-discuss] piano methods

[Marda]

Stephanie, you make some excellent points and I appreciate the suggestions.
Marda
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stephanie Pieck" <themusicsuite at verizon.net>
To: "'This is for discussing music and braille literacy'" 
<menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 10:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods


>I often come across the edition problem. It's frustrating and annoying, but
> I'm just glad I have Braille versions of ANY books! When I first started
> teaching, all I knew about was the John Thompson method and Bastien. 
> Yikes!
> I've come up with a few work-arounds over the yars. I'm not saying this
> isn't a problem, just that since there are so many other issues facing 
> blind
> music teachers, maybe the priority of keeping all the editions current
> should go down the list a ways.
>
> OK, some ideas:
>
> Find a local music store--if you have one--that you can develop a good
> working relationship with. The staff at my local independent shop know me
> and the situation with Braille editions. I've had conversations with them
> about when editions change, and when business is slow--which, sadly, seems
> to be more often these days--I've gone over books with them to compare. 
> Even
> if I don't have the same edition, it's helpful to know in advance of 
> working
> with a student that what they're looking at in print might differ a bit 
> from
> my Braille copy.
>
> Give students a chance to actively participate if they can. When starting
> with a new book, I'll often go through the table of contents with the
> student and make a note of any different pieces or page numbers. This
> usually only takes a few minutes and can save a lot of frustration and
> embarrassment down the line. I usually make notes for myself so I don't 
> have
> to keep repeating the process every time I've got someone using that same
> book.
>
> You can often find the older editions for sale on eBay. Check the ISBN
> numbers in the Braille and the publication year. It's a bit of extra
> digging, but it can work.
>
> One way to get a fairly regular influx of new and current editions is to 
> use
> the exam pieces from Associated Board of the Royal Schools of Music. RNIB
> embosses these, and even if you just borrow them through the international
> library service, you'll get almost 75 new pieces every two years ranging
> from elementary to very advanced. These books often include rather unusual
> pieces; I've had students enter competitions and other evaluation programs
> playing out of the exam books, and many times, they'll get comments on 
> their
> original and refreshing programming.
>
> Have backup plans. I like certain methods for certain kinds of students; 
> for
> example, the Alfred series is good for the average student starting at 
> about
> age 7. I like the Pauline Hall "Ten Fingers" series for really young
> kids--i.e., ages 4 to 7. Hal Leonard has a nice solo series to go along 
> with
> their method books--but again, they've gone to newer editions and some of
> the pieces in the Braille aren't in the new print books.
>
> The rate that new books come out is crazy. Sighted colleagues of mine have
> even said THEY can't keep up with it and find it frustrating.
>
> And as for colleagues: If you've got some in your area that you respect, 
> ask
> them to tell you what they're teaching and why. I used to worry that I was
> lagging way behind them because I couldn't get the newest editions in
> Braille. Well, surprise surprise: Many of them fall back on old standby's,
> too, and most ignore the newest editions, except when they attend those
> music education conferences with the fancy displays from publishers where
> they've got all the shiny new books spread out like candy in front of a
> bunch of captive 5-year-olds! It's impulse buying at that point, and I've
> even succumbed to it myself, buying print books that I came home and
> realized I'd never get transcribed ... and then gave away!
>
> Finally, if you do your job (teach music) well, your students will be the
> best demonstrations of your capability. If you use old methods but get 
> them
> to play with artistry and passion and develop sound technical skills, who
> cares?! I have yet to have a 7-year-old or their parent complain to me
> because I wasn't using the newest "thing" in music publishing. Usually, 
> they
> come to me because they want me to teach them. Teenagers like to play pop
> songs, sure, and sometimes a student will talk about a book one of their
> friends is using. But in twenty years of teaching, I've never had anyone 
> ask
> me to switch out of a book because they thought another, newer one was
> better.
>
> Stephanie Pieck
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On Behalf Of
> Marda
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 8:41 PM
> To: This is for discussing music and braille literacy
> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>
> Oh I hate that too.  Sometimes I wonder why they bother to make new
> editions.  I mean sometimes there are significant changes but often it 
> seems
> frustrating when only a piece here or there is different but that affects
> page numbers and so on.  I think too that there are visual reasons why
> editions change.  They want the pictures and things to be more modern or
> whatever.  Of course there's also the thing where if they print a new
> edition then people will buy it and they'll make more money.  I'm not 
> saying
> that we should just stick with old stuff, not at all.  I just think
> publishers often print new stuff too often.  Look at college textbooks for
> instance.  I won't even get started on that.  (smile) Marda
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Teresa Haifley" <dthaifley at iowatelecom.net>
> To: "'This is for discussing music and braille literacy'"
> <menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 6:34 PM
> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>
>
>>I second Marta's frustration on how hard it is to find current methods
>>in  braille.  I recently had a transfer student in the Faber series and
>>to my  horror and embarrassment discovered that the print book edition
>>was later  than the brailled copy, which I had no way of knowing had 
>>become
> outdated.
>> Many pieces were the same but the page numbers didn't match up because
>>a  different piece was thrown in here and there.
>>
>> We really need someone who can stay on top of these editions and keep
>> the braille current .
>>
>> Teresa
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On Behalf
>> Of Marda
>> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 6:19 PM
>> To: This is for discussing music and braille literacy
>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>
>> Hi, John.  I appreciated the message about bard having the American
>> Popular Piano Repertoire method.  I know it was mentioned initially by
>> someone outside the U.S. but I wouldn't have known about it otherwise
>> and now that I know NLS has it I want to investigate it for my own
>> teaching.  One of the things I find frustrating as a blind piano
>> teacher is how difficult it is to get current method books.  Is
>> American Popular Piano Repertoire available from NLS in hard copy
>> Braille or only on Bard?
>> Marda
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Hanson, John" <jhan at loc.gov>
>> To: "'This is for discussing music and braille literacy'"
>> <menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 5:57 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>
>>
>>>I recognize that there are a lot of people on this list from all over
>>>the world, which is why I noted that download is available for those
>>>registered for BARD.  I don't want to squelch information simply
>>>because not absolutely everyone has access.  This is an issue that
>>>some are addressing and wish to change, including myself.
>>>Furthermore, in this particular instance, American Popular Piano
>>>Repertoire was transcribed by Prima Vista Braille Music Services in
>>>Leeds, England. I know they sell their music at reasonable prices. One
>>>can inquire about
>> paper braille versus brf files.
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Stephanie Mitchell
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2014 7:04 PM
>>> To: menvi-discuss at menvi.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>>
>>> Not all of us can use the nls, as we live outside the us.
>>> Steph
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Hanson, John <jhan at loc.gov>
>>> To: "'Th is for discussing music and braille literacy'"
>>> <menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
>>> Date: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 11:53 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It should be made known that at least the American Popular Piano
>>>> Repertoire is available in brf format from NLS. Free download for
>>>> those registered for BARD.
>>>> John Hanson
>>>> NLS Music
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On
>>>> Behalf Of Stephanie Mitchell
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2014 8:51 AM
>>>> To: menvi-discuss at menvi.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>>>
>>>> Thank you. I am a member of the RNIB, although it's a pity I cant
>>>> get them in brf format.
>>>> I'm going to take a look at these.
>>>> Thanks again so much!
>>>> Steph
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Stephanie Pieck <themusicsuite at verizon.net>
>>>> To: "'Th is for discussing music and braille literacy'"
>>>> <menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
>>>> Date: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:35 pm
>>>> Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > The "American Popular Piano Repertoire" method is very good; very
>>>> > well-paced so students play a lot of different music before making
>>>> > huge jumps in difficulty. You might start in Level 1 or 2--the
>>>> > preparatory grade would probably be too easy for your adult student.
>>>> >
>>>> > I've never used the "Little Mozarts" book, but I find that Pauline
>>>> > Hall's "Tunes for Ten Fingers", "More Tunes for Ten Fingers," and
>>>> > "Fun for Ten Fingers" books generally captivate very young
>>>> > students while providing a very thorough foundation. These can be
>>>> > had from RNIB; if you can't purchase them, you may want to look
>>>> > into signing up for their international lending library service. I
>>>> > know it works; I borrowed old ABRSM exam books and used them for
>>>> > several
>> months.
>>>> >
>>>> > Hope this helps ...
>>>> >
>>>> > The Other Steph (Pieck)
>>>> >
>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On
>>>> > Behalf Of Stephanie Mitchell
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2014 9:36 PM
>>>> > To: menvi-discuss at menvi.org
>>>> > Subject: [Menvi-discuss] piano methods
>>>> >
>>>> > Speaking of piano books etc I do have a few questions. I have just
>>>> > taken on an adult student. I'm using the "piano lessons book 1" by
>>>> > Waterman which seems quite good. She already has knowledge of
>>>> > treble cleef and seems a little shaky with the bass but could
>>>> > still read it quite well.
>>>> > She wants to do pop as well and I was wondering what I could use
>>>> > along side the book work that would keep her interest. I need to
>>>> > have a braille copy too so I can follow along. I thought of the
>>>> > american popular piano or the easy Dan coates piano, but not sure
>>>> > if they would be too hard for her.
>>>> > Any ideas?
>>>> > Also, does anyone know if the "music for little mozarts" books are
>>>> > in braille? I have 4 year old who is keen to start and I'd heard
>>>> > good things about this book.
>>>> > Steph
>>>> >
>>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>>> > From: Stephanie Pieck <themusicsuite at verizon.net>
>>>> > To: "'Th is for discussing music and braille literacy'"
>>>> > <menvi-discuss at menvi.org>
>>>> > Date: Tuesday, June 3, 2014 9:50 pm
>>>> > Subject: Re: [Menvi-discuss] Yamaha piano course and gradings, any
>>>> > help?
>>>> >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Winy,
>>>> > >
>>>> > > One approach you can try to correlate grading systems is to try
>>>> > > and find pieces that are common to both and see which grade they
>>>> > > occur in on each scheme.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Alternatively, see when the student plays particular
>>>> > > scales--i.e., the ones with all those pesky sharps and
>>>> > > flats!--or when they move from playing scales in simpler form
>>>> > > (i.e., one octave only; hands separately; legato
>>>> > > only) to more advanced (with hands a third apart, for instance).
>>>> > >
>>>> > > An important thing to keep in mind is that grading systems are
>>>> > > highly subjective, and while they can provide a useful framework
>>>> > > for study, they aren't the be-all end-all of teaching.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Another gauge for progress is to ask the student "How long have
>>>> > > you studied?" Be prepared to take their answer with some
>>>> > > skepticism, however, because there's no guarantee that a student
>>>> > > who has taken lessons for five years will be playing Mozart
>>>> > > sonatas! If the Yamaha school has had a high rate of teacher
>>>> > > turnover, then the student may have studied for five or six
>>>> > > years, but with many changes in teaching methodology which will
>>>> > > hamper their progress. Just because a school follows a
>>>> > > curriculum doesn't mean that all the teachers employed by the
>>>> > school are equally adept at implementing it.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > In my own studio, whenever I am presented with a transfer
>>>> > > student, I use most of the first lesson to make my own
>>>> > > assessment, discussing with the student how long they've been
>>>> > > playing, what books they have used, and then having them play.
>>>> > > Prior to the lesson, I tell the student (or their parent) that I
>>>> > > will ask them to play some pieces they feel comfortable
>>>> > > with--things they may have played for a recital or exam, etc. I
>>>> > > ask them to bring the books they were last using to the
>>>> > class.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Once I've had them play their chosen pieces--which says a lot
>>>> > > about how they play, incidentally--I ask questions about the
>>>> > > books, like how far they've gotten in their current one, or if
>>>> > > they have any particular books they enjoyed using more than others.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > After that, I ask for scales, do some sight-reading (for many
>>>> > > students, this is where the real truth of their studies starts
>>>> > > showing itself), and finally, I give them a piece to start
>>>> > > working on with me.
>>>> > > This last item allows the student to experience my teaching
>>>> > > style and also lets me see their approach to learning--i.e.,
>>>> > > what do they struggle with; what comes easily; are they
>>>> > > attentive to details or oblivious to everything except the
>>>> > > current note they're staring at.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > If the student continues to come for lessons, then I begin to
>>>> > > work on technical things such as posture, hand position, etc.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > I read somewhere that the average student should be at ABRSM
>>>> > > Grade
>>>> > > 1 level after about one to two years. The grades can be taken
>>>> > > annually after that, although personally I think the gradient in
>>>> > > difficult between grades--i.e., moving from Grade 5 to Grade 6,
>>>> > > for instance, or Grade 7 to 8--gets a bit steeper toward the
>>>> > > higher end of the system.
>>>> > > I also think there's a bigger jump at the low end of the
>>>> > > system--so Grade 1 to 2 to 3 requires a bit more advancement
>>>> > > than going from 3 to 4
>>>> > to 5.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Of course, all these are just my own personal opinions. I make
>>>> > > no claims to be a "great teacher" or even an expert in anything.
>>>> > > But I hope some of it is helpful.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Stephanie Pieck
>>>> > >
>>>> > > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > > From: Menvi-discuss [mailto:menvi-discuss-bounces at menvi.org] On
>>>> > > Behalf Of Winy Kwany
>>>> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2014 2:16 AM
>>>> > > To: This is for discussing music and braille literacy
>>>> > > Subject: [Menvi-discuss] Yamaha piano course and gradings, any 
>>>> > > help?
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Hi all,
>>>> > > I have a new student. She is still studying in Yamaha Music
>>>> > > School here with Yamaha piano course curiculum. She said she
>>>> > > will have grade
>>>> > > 7 Yamaha piano exam in July or October this year. I did an
>>>> > > acessment on her and I found her playing level is for grade 2-3
>>>> > > (She hasn't used any pedaling yet, but have played simple Bach
>>>> > > and some classical pieces). I have some questions.
>>>> > > First, does anyone ever transcribed Yamaha piano course into
>>>> > > braille?
>>>> > > If so, where I can obtain them?
>>>> > > Second, how I can get the grading of Yamaha and ABRSM on track?
>>>> > > I am confused with the system. Yamaha has 13 grades, from grade
>>>> > > 13 to 1.
>>>> > > I read in the website, but I am still confused. For example, if
>>>> > > the student is in grade 7 Yamaha, in what grade will it be for
>>>> > > ABRSM?
>>>> > > Thanks in advance. Any input, suggestions, will be highly
>>>> > > appreciated.
>>>> > > Winy.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Please visit www.menvi.org/donate.html  to make a voluntary
>>>> > > contribution to MENVIs work.
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>>>> > >
>>>> > >
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>>>> >
>>>> > Mitchell Piano Studio
>>>> > Phone: 0450354342
>>>> > Web: www.mitchellpianostudio.com
>>>> >
>>>> > Please visit www.menvi.org/donate.html  to make a voluntary
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>>>> Mitchell Piano Studio
>>>> Phone: 0450354342
>>>> Web: www.mitchellpianostudio.com
>>>>
>>>> Please visit www.menvi.org/donate.html  to make a voluntary
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>>>
>>> Mitchell Piano Studio
>>> Phone: 0450354342
>>> Web: www.mitchellpianostudio.com
>>>
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